Attribution: Joe Mabel, CC BY-SA 3.0, via Wikimedia Commons
Featuring the Fabulous Dadbots: Dave S., Mark M., Mark O., Dennis C., John K., and Geoff Carter
CA State HS Track Meet, Clovis, CA
Been sometime since, if memory serves representative Curley, (D-Mequon/Costa Rica), shared a bunch of psychology links/takes pointing out the complexity of this issue, (copycat due to the vagaries of dynamic hormonal youth was one issue… a complex set of scenarios). One ‘issue’ was former males competing in women’s sports. (The issue is like a check valve in that respect, ay—not much about former women competing as men). Gavin recently called it unfair…and we all wondered if he would’ve said that had Kamala won. Local Rs used the meet to popularize populism. Shocking. A couple snips below. Solution: They simply gave out two medals if a trans athlete won one. Done. Interesting that this elegant solution—imo—was crafted in a panic, days before the meet. I want to know who thought of it. Brilliant. I included a few snips from the accounting of the event I thought relevant too.
The reason there are (3) on the first level podium in the pic below is because it was a high jump. The Trans girl won and there was a tie for 2nd. No clue how they normally break ties in high jump—never thought about it…I googled the answer but not going to bore you with it…it makes sense–but there can in fact be ties. AB Hernandez is the trans athlete. She also won the triple jump and was 2nd in the long jump.
Not in the story, but another important ‘solution’ imo: at the qualifying meets, those who would normally be nixed due to trans athletes taking a spot did make the state meet. They merely added a spot. Once again: Brilliant! Given the way the ladies handled it (hugs all around, like human beings…no biggie), it is easy to imagine the rest of the states and the world, adopting this simple solution. Wait…I take that back…not at all easy given the xenophobia/calcification/populism out there.
Trans Athlete in Political Storm Earns, and Shares, First Place in Event
Couple of coaches takes from the above article:
“At the meet, some coaches inside the stadium acknowledged the complexity of the situation and were sympathetic to the trans athlete’s place in the middle of a national debate. Martial Yapo, an assistant track coach at Santa Margarita High School, said the teenager has forced him to contemplate what he would do if he were to coach a trans athlete facing added scrutiny.”I don’t have the answer, but I’m going through the same processas many other people,” Mr. Yapo said. “But being a decent human ismore important.”
Bryn Williams, an assistant sprint coach at the school, which hadathletes competing Saturday, said the new measures about final placement seemed reasonable given that the issue arose such a short time before the event.
“I think it is the definition of a compromise – trying to meet in the middle over something knowing that not everyone is going to be100 percent happy with the decision that was made,” she said.”
(Trans Athlete in Political Storm Earns, and Shares, First Place in Event)
Clovis is near Fresno, sustainably speaking, a nice location in the middle of a very big state–not to mention a big economy.
DS
A cool and interesting story with a sort of Hollywood ending. The participants seemed mostly satisfied with how it worked out. They say if a mediator produces a result that neither party is happy with, they did their job. Nevertheless, the story won’t end here. The pols won’t let it end. This is red meat for culture warriors.
I’m glad you added the photograph. I had read the story prior but a picture adds important information. That Hernandez girl doesn’t tower over the other girls at all. She seems kinda petite. I wonder how old she was when she transitioned. It’s actually important in the debate. If a cis-male transitions after fully grown, they don’t lose their male skeletal or musculature structure. Those physiological feature are critical in a sport like track and field where it’s all about power and speed. Technique counts in some events, but success is mostly determined by inherent physical ability and training. The issue gets sticky thusly: there are female world records in the same events that men compete in, world records held by the most elite female athletes in the world, some of which have been held for decades. Every year in North America, hundreds (even thousands in some events) of men and boys, in all levels of competition from the pros to high school, surpass those records. The world fucking records! This will eventually lead to a blow up, when a trans athlete claims a new female world record. The international governing bodies (pun unintended) of Track and Field understand the dilemma and have required hormone level testing of female athletes to verify their “femaleness”, but I don’t know if the trans athlete issue has been similarly addressed.
Anywho, congratulations AB Hernandez. I’m glad this season worked out for you and I hope the poisonous political climate doesn’t kill the joyous memory.
MarkO
I thought the CA solution, though 11th hour, was awesome. Solves a complex, not to mention extinguishes an easy hot button for the right, especially the almighty Christian right. Of course the CA solution is not the best one to point to. Land of fruit and nuts vs. Midwest milk and honey (and corn…and custard…and brandy old fashioneds…) But I think a strong argument was the girls’ reaction—i.e. the athletes, the ones in the thick of it, were just fine with the solution. Hugs all around. The coaches, at least the ones the story chose to quote (and me to snip), were the adults in the room.
We wish they all could be California girllllllllllllllllllllllllllllls.
-d
Hey bots,
This is a great article, Dave, and definitely the most elegant solution I’ve seen, but I am sure you’re going to have the naysayers ranting on about everyone getting a participation medal, how “woke” society is making competition meaningless, and that giving up your penis is a sin. I’m thinking the whole trans-sport (is this a word?) thing is a non-winner from the starting gun. Even though the Hernandez kid isn’t built like a guy (or a female Russian shotputter—is this a word?), I think this whole issue is too foreign for the average Joe Six-pack.
Maybe if Caitlyn (Bruce) Jenner did a centerfold? Would you rather see a Burt Reynolds or a Pamela Anderson pose?
G
Yes, this is certainly a complex topic without always easy answers. I agree the participants in CA were mature about the whole thing. Maybe more mature than I would be. It was a good solution to present 2 medals if a trans athlete won, and it was a compromise that all apparently accepted. My limited experience is that younger folks (Gen Z, Millennials) are pretty open to differences and accepting of differences. (A pretty broad statement, I know) Nonetheless it gives me pause when one considers the effect there may be at more advanced levels of competition in high school and beyond. Would it be fair if a trans athlete who perhaps transitioned later in life competed against women at the collegiate level in swimming or other anaerobic and aerobic competitions? Would they have an unfair advantage? Should a trans athlete get paid NIL money at the college level?
Unfortunately these issues have become enmeshed in politics and can become emotionally loaded. Perhaps the participants in CA are an example of how to move forward by finding solutions we can all agree upon.
John the newbie
Complex indeed Mr. Newbie! The latest culture war scoreboard update I saw was the University of Pennsylvania (pick one):
a. Settled a federal civil rights lawsuit against them,
–or–
b. Caved to Trump Administration intimidation
by banning transgender athletes from their interscholastic sports teams. Apparently they had a trans swimming champion that triggered the lawsuit.
MarkO
Closer to home, USCF (United States Cycling Federation) rolled through Wisconsin last week. Used to be called Super Week. Various events, various classes–epic tradition. Downer Ave Crit, with its acute and obtuse turns is legendary–and crits are great for spectators. Well, recent headlines tell the story of a trans athlete winning a road race down in Lyons (near Lake Geneva). Other competitors were not pleased. Here is one story link:
Trans athlete wins USA Cycling women’s event as female opponents protest and speak out
In case you are curious USCF cycling classes are ones and twos (usually racing together with Pros often tossed in to spice up the event). Threes and fours, usually racing together and citizens (now called novice)—separate. I climbed all the way up to citizen’s level–😎, back in the day—(one has to fill in an entry form, mine was perfect). There are other categories (Jrs, Masters—by age group, (the above).
-d.
That’s interesting because when I examined the award stand photo sent in your previous email, I thought to myself (and told Lynn), that woman in green does not have “child bearing hips” like the other women up there. It still looks to me like she has my hips, which are barely wide enough to support my beer belly. Maybe she is just at the low end of the cis-female hip size distribution or maybe something else is attributable.
I’m kind of embarrassed to be spending time and calories typing on this topic. It seems so damn trivial. On the other hand, it’s not trivial to people who train their asses off to compete and win in these athletic competitions.
MarkO
Ok…I was not going to further this, but since MO wasted calories on it, I will too.
Why don’t they adopt the California HS T & F model? ( I asked self). A: No clue, but I’m guessing USCF is run on a pursestring budget with “staff” (volunteers) all consumed with getting sponsors and race logistics—which are massive—ironed out. Also, our bot polemic is not yet public.
I thought about it and unlike T & F, I think the dual 1st (or 2nds, 3rds,…) does not work in cycling. This is primarily due to drafting being legal. It is part and parcel of cycling savvy. Ay. For example” if a T rider was identified, the pack could:
Just let him/her/they go off the front. This would be ok. The T would win and then we’d have the other winner too.
- But what if the T does not want to go off the front? It’s hell up there, no matter one’s sex….fighting the wind alone… Even if a T did try and go, the pack would likely reel ‘em in.
- My opinion: F!, no clear path in cycling. Test me on this
- Separate Trans class. Great! Race of 1, maybe 2. No work.
- Dual podiums: Good luck with that per the above. Cycling is often a “team sport” until the final sprint. All riders are tied at the hip…teammates for the most part, then, suddenly bitter opponents at the bell lap.
d.
The politics of the peloton could be brutal in that case. Similar to racing with someone who the community knows is doping. There are tactics to try to punish dopers but they aren’t always effective. For example, riders knew (or strongly suspected) Lance Armstrong was doping but couldn’t prevent him from winning all the Tours de France.
MarkO
I have–maybe–a final thought on this. In some states, high school wrestling is a co-ed sport. No bots, I know what you’re thinking. Not “wrestling in the backseat of your parents’ LTD during a drive-in movie” but actual wrestling. Competitors are determined by weight, and cunning is as important as strength in the sport. Why isn’t there an outcry about sweaty boys and girls rolling around together on a mat? If a trans–either way–wanted to be a wrestler (at least in the districts where it’s allowed), who could deny it?
G
Oh, you had to start it up again, huh Geoff? My take on the coed wrestling question of, Why isn’t there an outcry about sweaty boys and girls rolling around together on a mat?, is that I don’t believe the controversy is about genders touching each other or even competing together. It would be if the competitors were naked, but they aren’t. Anyway, I believe the issue is unfair advantage in sporting competitions. Correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe coed wrestling is exclusively the case of girls choosing to compete on primarily boys wrestling teams. The girls don’t have an unfair advantage. If a boy was to elect to compete on a predominantly female wrestling team, that would be another matter. If there are female prep wrestling teams, I’m not aware of it. As a spectator sport for adolescent boys, girl wrestling would be irresistible. Again, another topic.
MarkO
You’re right that fairness is the logical side of the issue, but I think logic is a prerequisite for the far-right argument. A lot of the Christian nationalists pissing and moaning about undoing God’s will and whatnot by acknowledging–and undoing God’s handiwork with trans boys and girls. Their strict moral codes (ha) wouldn’t allow for sweaty boys and girls rolling around in mortal combat—clothed or not.
You know what they say: premarital sex gives you hairy palms or brain damage or something… And coed wrestling is just a subversive way to get sexual pleasure—I know. I heard God say so through the TV.
G